Kaye Kelly — Building a Sustainable Creative Career Today

What if your performing arts career was built to last—not just to launch? 🎭

In this episode, we sit down with Kaye Kelly—Berklee College of Music professor, singer-songwriter, and author of The Modern Creative: A Practical Guide for 21st Century Artists—to explore how today’s artists can build resilient, values-driven, and financially sustainable careers.

Kaye’s book doubles as a field manual and workbook, and together we unpack her prompts and practices for defining your artistic narrative, mapping multiple income streams, and getting grants within reach.

We trace how the creative landscape has evolved through streaming, the pandemic, and AI—and why artists now thrive by wearing many hats. Kaye shares what professionalism really looks like: reply fast, communicate clearly, show up prepared, and think strategically.

From teaching, arranging, and session work to licensing and arts leadership, we dig into building a portfolio career with both active and passive income. Then we go straight to the money talk—budgeting for unpredictable income, planning for taxes, and starting retirement early.

Community engagement emerges as both a compass and a growth engine. Kaye walks us through ways to connect with local cultural councils, public art initiatives, and small grant programs that align your work with community priorities while expanding your audience.

We close with the habits that protect creativity—silence, privacy, and device discipline—and small rituals like journaling to shift into creative flow.

Forget the starving artist myth. Choose alignment, guard your time, and let your creativity evolve across seasons.

All episodes are also available in video form on our YouTube Channel. All episodes are hosted by Elizabeth (Lizzie) Bowman.

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Don't hesitate to reach out to us with guest ideas, information you'd like covered, or any ideas you might have—the hope is for this to be a continuous resource and dialogue with our listeners.

Visit TheSceneRoom.com for more information.

Chapters

• 0:00 Intro to Kaye Kelly
• 1:19 Inspiration for The Modern Creative
• 3:26 How The Industry Shifted
• 4:19 Building A Portfolio Career
• 4:45 Workbook Tools And Artist Narrative
• 5:31 Defining Success On Your Terms
• 6:33 Entrepreneur Skills That Matter
• 7:43 Community Engagement That Works
• 10:24 Art Aligned With Place And People
• 10:53 End The Starving Artist Myth
• 11:21 Schools Must Teach Money
• 13:25 Too Many Majors Or More Paths
• 16:30 Transferable Skills From Music
• 18:25 Staying Creative Amid Real Life
• 21:12 Pressure, Timelines, And Mental Health
• 22:48 Journaling As A Creative Switch
• 24:28 Guard Your Creative Time
• 26:45 Tech Tools Versus Distraction
• 27:44 Where to find Kaye Kelly and Purchase her Book

Transcript

Elizabeth Bowman: 0:00

Hi, I'm Elizabeth Bellman and welcome to season two of The Scene Room. Today I have Kay Kelly, a veteran faculty member at Berkeley College of Music in Boston, where she teaches ear training as well as classes on artistry, creativity, and professional development. She recently released her first book titled The Modern Creative: Practical Guide for 21st Century Artists. She is an active singer, songwriter, arranger, and band leader. And she is also an expert grant writer and an advocate for independent artists. So I'm delighted to have her on the podcast to find out what the best tools are for the modern creative in today's world. If you are enjoying the podcast, please like, share, review, do all those free things to help get the word out. I really appreciate it. I am really excited about the response I'm getting on YouTube in particular in terms of the views. So thanks for coming and let's get to the conversation. Okay, welcome to the scene room. Thanks so much for being here.

Kaye Kelly: 1:17

Thank you so much for inviting me today.

Elizabeth Bowman: 1:19

It was so great to receive your book that you have just recently released. Can you tell our listeners about the book and I guess really a brief history of who you are? So, you know, where this idea to write the book came from. Sure.

Kaye Kelly: 1:38

So I just released a book at the end of August called The Modern Creative: a Practical Guide for 21st Century Artists. So I'm an artist. I've been an artist for the last, I guess, 30 plus years. I'm a musician and now author, and I also do some painting as well. So I've as I've aged, I've become more of an interdisciplinary, multidisciplinary artist versus just musician. I am a full-time professor at Berkeley College of Music. This is my 25th year teaching there. My home department is actually ear training. So I teach students how to read, write, and interpret music, but I also teach a lot of classes on artistry and creativity, as well as professional development, to older college students. So at that point, usually juniors and seniors that are getting ready to launch, leave Berkeley and move on to their careers. So a lot of the material that I created in that class ultimately ended up in this book and a lot of ideas and the things that I was seeing. I've been teaching those classes for close to 20 years, things I was seeing in my students that they needed. So the book idea, I think, was I'm not sure when the moment was where I decided it was going to be a book, but I I was constantly creating materials for the class. I really like to do graphic design, so I was making handouts. Eventually at some point I thought this is actually like I've already written part of a book. So when I sat down to do it, it actually came out pretty quickly. I say that tongue in cheek because it really did take a year. Some of that was really, really hard work. But when I sat down to kind of scope out the chapters and things I wanted to say, that part was very easy for me.

Elizabeth Bowman: 3:12

So teaching for 20 years, what are some main things that have contributed to this modern creative? What transformations have happened over that 20-year period that you can pinpoint?

Kaye Kelly: 3:26

Sure. So I think, you know, obviously the music industry has continued to change. We've all gone through a pandemic that really had a big effect on the arts in all types of arts. I think the things that I see have changed. I think that students need to be more strategic and ready to do multiple types of things as a creative person to bring in income. I think, you know, when I got a degree in vocal performance, super, super practical, you know, um, and didn't really have any career help in terms of what would come next. But I think, you know, the idea was, okay, you're gonna go out and you're gonna, you know, make a CD and go on tour and, you know, get picked up by a label. It's very much not the way I see things happening now for my students. I really try to work with them on considering all the different parts and pieces of what it might take to live full-time, if that's what they want full-time as an artist. So we talk about passive income, active income, all different types of ways to be a musician. But I think those lessons fold out into dance, into visual art as well. We need to be able to wear a lot of different hats to make this work.

Elizabeth Bowman: 4:33

In terms of the role of your book, I have read the book and I noticed that throughout you have base for the reader to input their own ideas and their own messaging, I guess. Can you tell us a little bit about that and the importance of that?

Kaye Kelly: 4:49

Sure. Sure. At the end of every chapter, I've got a couple pages for writing, journaling, prompt questions. The book is a little bit more of a workbook. So it allows the reader to work on some of the concepts that are talked about in the book. So, for instance, learning how to write your narrative as an artist, who you are, what you believe in, what you're trying to say with your art. I've got workbook space for visualizing your creative space and what things are important to you for your creative space, your creative habits. At the end of the book, I have a section for alternative funding for artists, and I've got a big chunk of information about artist grants in there. So there's actually workbook pages to try to write your first mini-grant assignments.

Elizabeth Bowman: 5:31

How do you define success as an artist today, in your opinion, with all the metrics we have and I guess the now social media that we didn't used to have?

Kaye Kelly: 5:44

I think all that's changed kind of everything. For me, for most artists that are kind of in the mid-career, I think success for me right now means being able to say yes and no to projects that I align with. And those are things I could not do in my 20s or 30s. I needed to say yes to everything so I could pay the bills, pretty well established now, so I can really choose the projects that I feel deeply aligned with. And I'm okay saying no to things that, you know, it's hard to say no as an artist, maybe a lost opportunity or lost income. You know, there's always the fear of missing out, and to be able to say, nope, I'm okay to let that project go. Someone else will appreciate that, and I'm gonna stay in my lane.

Elizabeth Bowman: 6:23

In terms of the skills that have to be developed, obviously there's the importance of being an entrepreneur as an artist. And I I think that that's been important for the last, I guess, at least 15, 10 years. Like it started emerging, and how has that transformed things? And and what particular entrepreneurs' skills do you think are at the top in terms of necessity?

Kaye Kelly: 6:50

I think honestly, so much of the success of artists that I see, artists in all genres, it doesn't always have to do with the talent of that artist, of the the best musician, the best artist, the best dancer. Uh, so much of it is really the professionalism they carry with them, their work ethic, their persistence to stay in the game. Like that part is maybe the hardest because this is a hard kind of like who can stay in this the longest, that person is gonna still be be standing. But I think it's a lot of that old-fashioned work ethic, being able to communicate well, answer your text, say yes to the gig, say no to the gig, but say something right away. And also just the strategy of looking ahead. And I find that that is something emerging artists still need help with, but they are very savvy in knowing that they're going to have to be an entrepreneur and learning the different facets of what they can do with their artistry.

Elizabeth Bowman: 7:43

So in season two of the scene room, my overarching theme is community engagement, because I think that that is the main ingredient necessary in terms of performing arts organizations, becoming more successful. And then also I would say that for artists, that's very important, the role of community and the artist. How would you advise an artist to connect with their community or engage?

Kaye Kelly: 8:16

In the United States, at least, almost every state has an arts council of some sort. And that a lot of them are local, like Massachusetts, for example, has 329 cultural councils. Those are 329 towns that have cultural councils, local cultural councils that are run by volunteers. So that's just an easy email, phone call, check-in with them. Often they need volunteers. Not every artist wants to do that. I can say I'd done that, and it was one of the most rewarding things I've done in my life. Letting them know you they exist, that you you're there for them. The community that I live in, we work a lot with artists and we've really built up arts and culture in our community. I can say this month we have a brand new mural that's painted across our train station, which is just really something special. Not it's it goes around the whole building that was created by a local artist in my town who apparently is on the cultural council as well. I think there's a lot of ways to get involved. I really enjoyed bringing in as an arts leader in my town, bringing in other talent into my town. I thought that was an important thing to do to kind of change things up a little bit, diversity, different types of music, different types of art into the town and just kind of um stir things up a little bit rather than having kind of the same old, you know, we we most communities have a staple group of artists, and it's it's nice, it's good for everybody to have new things to give input in to uh whether it's music again or a painter, having someone come give a masterclass, it's a win-win for everybody.

Elizabeth Bowman: 9:44

But do you think that in terms of the artist identity and what they are creating and having that creative process link in to what the community is doing? You know what I mean? So for instance, for that mural painter, obviously what they were painting must relate closely to what the community believes in. You have to be very aware of your surroundings and what are the important things. So if you're planning a recital, then you might want to plan repertoire that addresses a certain issue or something that is prevalent to where you are, right?

Kaye Kelly: 10:23

Absolutely. I mean, I think my part of working in my community as an artist has been to help our community heal from a pandemic where we weren't able to communicate. Um, a lot of political things that are happening historically across our country. It's a great place for artists to be right in the middle of that because we can build bridges between different groups, can get community out and talking to one another. I've put on arts and cultural festivals in my community as a way to, after the pandemic, at least get out of their houses, talk to one another, appreciate different types of art, different types of music, celebrate the art and music that we do have already in our community. I think artists are are a great way to lead lead forward right now in terms of again building bridges. In a lot of things that are going on nationally, we can be right in the middle of that. I don't know. It's it's it's a privilege to be able to be in that that position. It's a softer way to build bridges.

Elizabeth Bowman: 11:21

What do you think is the biggest misconception people have today about being an artist?

Kaye Kelly: 11:29

I think the myth of the starving artist needs to be put to death. We need to end that because I think it's not helpful or productive to anything. And does that exist? Of course, somewhere it exists, but I think 21st century artists deserve more than that. I think they're very smart and savvy and, like you said, entrepreneurial. We are not starving, we are hustling like we always have. I think we need to put that myth to rest.

Elizabeth Bowman: 11:53

And then in in terms of our structure and our education system, how do you feel that institutions need to evolve in order to support this modern creative identity?

Kaye Kelly: 12:06

I feel like every school, every art school in particular, needs to have way more focus, mandatory focus on business and finance. I know where I teach, we're doing a pretty good job with that, but I think more and more and more, uh, as you know, in my book, I interviewed a lot of different people. And the middle section of the book, I interviewed, gosh, the bass player from Chicago and James Taylor's background singer and a Broadway dancer, photographer, lots and lots of different people. And I asked a series of questions. And one of the last questions was, you know, if what would you say to your 18-year-old self? And almost everybody said to me, I wish someone had taught me more about managing my money. I wish someone had told me sooner to start putting money away. Like across the board, that was the answer. I think we're not really great as artists about thinking about eventual retirement. We're not putting money away for that. And I think that every other career is. So I think more talk about money management, also what our budget looks like as a creative person, because it's really different than someone who's gone into accounting.

Elizabeth Bowman: 13:10

Yeah, when I went to university for my voice performance degree, there was no financial literacy course. Although you if you take an English major, there's no financial literacy course either. So this is an interesting conversation because I've been reading in my newsfeed about how there's a somewhat of a controversy at the moment in terms of university performance programs, in terms of um musicians and how many students they bring into their program and uh the correlation between that number and the number of people who will ultimately be successful in holding down a full-time performance job, which can be in some institutions uh down to 1% of those students. So you go and do a performance degree, and then you would then have to potentially take another degree in order to bolster your resume to do what it is you ultimately end up doing. What are your thoughts on that?

Kaye Kelly: 14:18

I don't disagree. I mean, uh we we are taking in tons and tons of students to prepare them for a performance world that might not have room for them. I think getting back to the kind of wearing many hats, though, I think if I could go back to my 18 or 20-year-old self, like I wish someone could have said to me, You yes, awesome, you have uh a degree in in jazz vocal singing. Did you know that, you know, these are six things that you could do in terms of performance, but these are six other things that you can also make money at in terms of creative jobs that might not necessarily be singing, but uh, you know, you can teach, you can do voiceovers in a studio, you can sing background vocals in a studio, you can get paid to transcribe music, you can arrange music. I wish I would have known more about that. And at that point, even like writing for TV and film and writing jingles, there were so many more things I wish I would have known sooner. And you know, my my students do know all these things now. I think we're just trying to stay on top of it. Like writing for TV and film for the last maybe 10 years has been a great way for songwriters to be able to make significant income. But AI has is changing the landscape for that. So just, you know, I write this a zillion times in the book, being flexible, being able to move, being able to do a lot of things, whatever you're if you're choosing to get a degree in art, be sure you're you're really well-rounded and that you can do a lot of things with your art and maybe not pigeonhole yourself into one thing.

Elizabeth Bowman: 15:46

Yeah, my feeling is that my performance degree was invaluable to what I ended up doing. So, of course, I've worked my entire career in the performing arts on the administrative side, but I don't think I would have been able to do what I'm doing so successfully without having really steeped myself into that vocal performance degree. I really understood at the end of that degree the level of commitment required, the the skills required, the the mental game of the performing artist, and all the languages required in in terms of opera singing and that study as well. I feel like, while of course, you should have this, like you say, they should definitely tell you about these careers that you can have with this particular degree. But I also feel like as you go through this journey and you learn more and more about yourself, because ultimately you do when you're studying a creative craft, you end up connecting with yourself and what you're interested in. And then when you decide to potentially maybe go back to school, to law school or med school or any of these other professional schools that you might end up in, I think that the music education provides such an interesting toolkit for those people in those other industries. I really am up the camp that it's okay to have all the students in the performing artist programs because ultimately people have the dream. Like, I mean, I had the dream when I first got into the program. I was, yes, I'm gonna be on the opera stage and I'm gonna sing and I'm gonna do all these things. But at the end of my degree, I changed my tune, literally, and felt like I I was actually gravitating more towards the marketing and PR side of things, and that's what ended up happening. But no one would have been able to tell me that in the first year.

Kaye Kelly: 17:53

Like of course, of course. I think one thing we tend to overlook is generally creative people. I think going to college is a great idea. I think it's it's also financially very, very difficult in our our country. I think you do you learn all of these different skills. Creative people are generally really good problem solvers. And having a four-year degree where you're really around other creative people all the time, you're around creative professors, I think that's invaluable. And whether you go on to get a law degree or a medical degree later, awesome. Because, you know, I think those careers need creative problem solvers that are able to think outside of the box. We need that in every career.

Elizabeth Bowman: 18:31

I think we're so many transferable skills like public speaking and uh, you know, all of these CEOs getting up to talk. I mean, they would all benefit from a degree in voice.

Kaye Kelly: 18:44

Yeah. Or just be being up there in front of everybody all the time, or having to put yourself out there so often because that's such a vulnerable space that we we put ourselves into again and again and again, whether it's auditioning or giving a performance or sharing something online. You know, we really do put ourselves out there in in a way that other careers don't have to do.

Elizabeth Bowman: 19:04

For sure. How do you personally stay connected to your creative self now? You mentioned you you're a multidisciplinary artist, so tell us more.

Kaye Kelly: 19:14

Yeah. So side note, but it goes wrong. I'm also a mom of four kids, four kids, six pets, busy household. And as I've gotten older and really been able to verbalize and figure out like what it is that I need to be creative, the thing that I need the most is silence. Silence and privacy. Those are the things that I know that I need to be creative. And everybody's different. Some people do need loud music. And for me, I need a closed door. And as you can imagine, that's that's pretty tough to do. I have figured that out. It took me a long time, and I I've written a little bit about that in my book, just about creative spaces. And like for me, having doors that I can close now and some silence and some privacy has doubled my production. But I also feel like I think when I was a younger mom, I always was so worried I was gonna fall behind as an artist. I wasn't going to be able to keep up or to be productive. And that was true for a while, that I really did have to take a break. Having kids for me and a lot of acid reflux with pregnancy, with both my pregnancies and those all-nighters that you're playing with kids really wreck your voice. So I I did step away. But what I found is that I think creative people, which I consider myself to be, I always find a way to, I, you know, I couldn't get out to gig, but I started writing music more because that was something I could do when the kids went to bed. So I I kind of feel a little bit for for anybody who is worried or that they're putting things off while they have kids, or I just feel like saying it's it's okay because creativity is going to come out of you another way. And it continually has for me, even in writing a book, which was not ever on my artist bingo card, like I never thought I would I would write a book, but that it just presented itself to me. I think we have creativity coming out of us. I think you probably do as a as a marketer and as somebody who has a performance degree. I think it just might come out of us in other ways. So I always am telling my students, just again, you have to be flexible and you have to give yourself a lot of grace.

Elizabeth Bowman: 21:12

Isn't it interesting that there's there seems to be this mystical age associated with creativity and the idea, yeah, that we have to have our creative output before a certain time. Otherwise, it's over. Why would it be over? Of course it's not over. You can be creative at any age.

Kaye Kelly: 21:33

Absolutely, absolutely. But I do think our emerging artists can't see that far yet. And there's so much pressure on them, even financially, if they've completed a degree. There's so much pressure on them to go forward and do something amazing and be the next, you know, star. And really, I think that's that's such a small percentage of students that are able to go on and do that. It really sets us up for failure and for mental health issues. I think that's just the wrong way to go about it. Yes, get your art degree of any sort and move on into the world in in the creative industry. Just like to make the scope bigger, make the scope bigger. You got a degree in performing arts, you got a degree in visual arts, awesome. Go out and just live a creative life, join the creative industry. I wish we talked about it more that way, versus you have this tiny little path that you have to be so amazing that you are the one chosen one that's gonna get get picked or go viral or all these other things, which are are great and that does happen to some people, but really such a small percent. I think it's not not healthy for us to for us to teach thousands of students that that's gonna be their their existence.

Elizabeth Bowman: 22:40

Also, the pressure doesn't necessarily help with the creative process.

Kaye Kelly: 22:44

Not at all, not at all.

Elizabeth Bowman: 22:46

Definitely interferes with all of that. I do have a question for you because your book is very like you have the it's a workbook, like you say. And so there are a lot of questions you ask your readers to answer. And I'm wondering, because of the way you've written your book, is journaling practice that you engage in daily? Is it a discipline for you? Is it part of your process?

Kaye Kelly: 23:12

Well, the first answer is no, that's not a practice I use in my life. I I have done it before when I was songwriting a lot. I think that comes from a lot of the activities I do with young artists in terms of getting them to figure out what their artist narrative is. I do a lot of work, like a month of work with them figuring out how to write an artist statement and what are their why are they creating in the first place? What is their why? So I feel like that part of my book has come from that experience in my life from being a college professor. But I will say as an artist, I it is a great tool for anybody out there listening. It's a great way to get all the garbage out of your head before you sit down to create. So I definitely talk to my students about having some type of transitional period between your regular life and when you sit down to create. So you're not just, you know, sitting down and expected to go. I I I know I can't do that, but uh sitting and journaling for 15 minutes, 20 minutes and not really paying attention to your your grammar necessarily, your punctuation, just writing, writing, writing, writing, writing. It's a great way to clear your head and get all of that out so you are clear and can sit down and have have open space ready to to use in your head.

Elizabeth Bowman: 24:21

Yeah. During the pandemic, darkness for for most of the creative industry. Um, especially I I would say in the classical performance industry, because they weren't in the recording studio like a lot of the pop and jazz artists were able to do. So anyway, I found it a very challenging time and like like most. And I started journaling during that time. I don't do it now, but I gotta say that if you're in a place, journaling is great. And I also ended up writing a ton of songs during the pandemic as a result of that, which is also not something I do. I've I haven't written a song since the pandemic.

Kaye Kelly: 25:06

So maybe you need to to create the the same scenario that the pandemic allowed you to be in a near year.

Elizabeth Bowman: 25:13

No, thank you. It's fine with me. But it was an interesting period. And uh the idea that creativity stems from I guess intense emotion was very evident in that time. Yeah, so I guess to close out this interview, what things would you want to tell our listeners about anything that I may have missed? I think questions.

Kaye Kelly: 25:38

For the artist that might be listening, just to learn to fiercely protect your space, your creative space, because I think that's something most of us aren't aren't really great at. We tend to take care of everybody else first. We prioritize everything except our time to make our art. That's an easy thing for us to do. So really scheduling that and being true to it, turning off your phones, getting rid of electronic devices, and unless that's something that helps you in your creativity, but like really trying to carve out that time, schedule it as if it's an appointment, let your family know, let your friends know, let your mom know. I'm not answering my phone, really making that a priority. I think creative time can be seen as a hobby to friends and family. Like you're just painting, so I, you know, it's not important. I really need you to do this. And for those of us that are either trying to make a living through this or just trying to create something important, it is something we have to teach the people around us. I am going to do this. This is my time, I need to do this. Being able to set those boundaries and recognizing that you you need them because otherwise everybody else will will take up your space.

Elizabeth Bowman: 26:45

Yeah, especially in this world, like you say, these phones constantly grabbing our attention and distracting us, I think that that's really impeding on a lot of the creative process in general. So putting down the phone, yeah, putting it on an airplane.

Kaye Kelly: 27:03

It gets tricky. I think, you know, a lot of students will use apps that help them with their creativity also. So it's you know, whether it's having a gr having grooves on your phone to write to as a musician, keeping a metronome, uh, recording. There's so many things that can be helpful as an artist, but there's it's locked into your texts and your notifications as well. So it's really you have to be very disciplined to turn everything off if that's the way that you want to use your phone during creative time. It's just too easy to get a message from someone and get derailed. So yeah, if if it's possible for you to put your phone in another room to create, I highly recommend that.

Elizabeth Bowman: 27:43

Great. Well, thank you for being in the scene room. So wonderful to talk to you. And I hope that our listeners will check out your book.

Kaye Kelly: 27:50

Thank you so much. Um, they can find me at OneCreative Life in most places, most social media, and my website is kelly.com, where I have everything there the new book and how to book me for speaking and singing. Thank you.